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Saturday Open Thread
Saturday, May 1, 2010
Did Arizona do the right thing in passing its immigration legislation? What else should be done to "reform" the system?
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Connie
What else should be done? I think that Sheriff Joe Arpaio should be given permission to take all the illegals out of his tent city, clad only in their pink underwear, chain them together in one long line, and walk them back to the Mexican border. That will guarantee they won't cross into Arizona again.
Posted May 1, 2010 at 12:24:17 AM
Bill
Absolutely!!
Posted May 1, 2010 at 9:38:47 AM
William McCrindle
They absolutely did the right thing, and those protesting are ignorant of the law (go figure, liberals not reading legislation), as it uses the same language as the Federal laws on illegal immigration. There is also specific language to preclude profiling the protestors decry. If the Arizona legislature passes and the Governor signs the right to carry law, AZ may be the best state to retire in! Another law enforcement official was shot by illegals last week. If the Mexicans can't come in or stay legally, then get OUT!
Posted May 1, 2010 at 9:52:27 AM
hadenuf
You bet they did the right thing! Our government is refusing to uphold our LAWS, and we are being overrun and taxed to death to pay for these invader's social services, hospitalizations etc. Just read today that a deputy was shot in the stomach IN ARIZONA BY AN ILLEGAL WHO HAD JUST GOTTEN OUT OF A HOSPITAL. There is a legal way to apply for citizenship and knocking down the door to the country and making yourself welcome isn't it. Our government is corrupt and is refusing to uphold the laws that have worked well for years, until the government started ignoring them for VOTES.
TODAY, MAY 1st WOULD BE AN EXCELLENT DAY FOR ICE TO DO IT'S JOB, FOR A CHANGE.
Posted May 1, 2010 at 10:55:26 AM
Duke of Earl
Of course they did. There was an article on the web this morning about a Deputy Sheriff in Arizona being shot and wounded by a suspected drug smuggler. This is further evidence (proof really) of what Arizona is trying to guard against.
What conservatives need to do is organize boycotts of the same states and cities that are proposing the boycott of Arizona. If Major League Baseball pulls the 2011 All-Star game from Arizona; Baseball should be boycotted.
Boycotts should be organized against the TV, radio and print media that are encouraging the Arizona boycott. Do not buy a newspaper, watch a TV program or listen to a radio program that encourages the boycott.
Above all, DO NOT engage is histrionics with the lefties. We MUST KEEP OUR COOL or the next military exercise will be targeting anti-boycotters.
Duke
Posted May 1, 2010 at 12:06:26 PM
mark Cancemi
Absolutely! X 10!
Posted May 1, 2010 at 12:16:27 PM
suek
Maybe legalize marijuana? I'm basically against it, but if my choice is between the marijuana or the drug runners that are bringing it in, I'll take the pot - at least the damage caused will be limited to those who choose to use it.
Of course - a secure border so that drug runners can't get in would be preferable, but barring that solution, legalizing pot would go a long way to eliminate the attraction.
Posted May 1, 2010 at 3:17:27 PM
P.
Did Arizona, do the RIGHT thing...You better Believe It!!!
Come on Calif...Grow some Balls...
Being Illegal IS a CRIME !!!
Posted May 1, 2010 at 6:11:47 PM
btooker
Yes, it was the right thing. Since when is it "wrong" to enforce the law?
"Discernment is not a matter of simply telling the difference between what is right and wrong; rather, it is the difference between right and almost right." -- Charles Spurgeon
Amnesty for illegals isn't even almost right!
Posted May 1, 2010 at 6:24:23 PM
walter w.
Several of us in California have already started
a ban-the-boycott. We have written to the Arizonia Governor with our support. We will purchase products manufactured in Arizona and also intend to vacation there.
We are encouraging every patriot to do the same.
Posted May 1, 2010 at 6:57:23 PM
Mclandmike
You do whatca' got to do.
Posted May 1, 2010 at 7:06:50 PM
Merry Colin
Watch this video on immigration and how it will destroy the environment of the U.S. If those progressives really give a hoot about being "green" they'd let no one come here. No kidding, this is scary. Please pass it along.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=5871651411393887069#
Posted May 1, 2010 at 7:34:53 PM
Rob
The founders often expressed concern about immigration of large amounts of people who would jeopardize the republic due to their lack of morals and understanding of liberty. However, I do not know of a call by the founders for federal law keeping such individuals out of our land. This is interesting knowing their reverence for limited government with few powers. Did they then believe that the federal government had no place in keeping individuals out of the land despite the consequences of such people flooding in? Can some one find a writing from a founder which calls for federal law to keep a handle on who is within our borders? I think I raise some good questions...
Posted May 2, 2010 at 12:05:46 AM
Murray Kupersmith
Jan Brewer showed us what a real Governor is. She had the gumption to do what unquestionably had to be done to protect her people. She displayed more character and responsibility than most of those in government today.
1) Finish the fence.
2) Get the National Guard to the border and round-up all who come across, then do what Eisenhower did; transport them by bus, train and ship into central Mexico.
See:
http://www.csmonitor.com/2006/0706/p09s01-coop.html
"Unlike today, Mexicans caught in the roundup were not simply released at the border, where they could easily reenter the US. To discourage their return, Gen. Swing arranged for buses and trains to take many aliens deep within Mexico before being set free...Tens of thousands more were put aboard two hired ships, the Emancipation and the Mercurio. The ships ferried the aliens from Port Isabel, Texas, to Vera Cruz, Mexico, more than 500 miles south."
Posted May 2, 2010 at 12:16:22 AM
H Hazell
What I find remarkable is how off the mark the media and so many politicians are on this law. I read through the law three times and can't make the connections in content or in context with the aleged attributes of the law as presented in the press. Their deliberate misrepresentation, though not unexpected, has spread into what I once thought were rational people.
Posted May 2, 2010 at 12:38:39 AM
archer52
The law is badly written by lawyers at the state level trying to outsmart future lawyers who will inevitably bring lawsuits against it. In an effort to avoid their own accountability, the lawyers wrote it in such a way that it puts the police officer on the street in a jam.
I know this because I was that police officer on the street for twenty years. This is in my wheelhouse.
At my website I have gone through, in detail, the problems with it. www.truthandcommonsense.com is the site.
Briefly, the bill criminalizes almost every aspect of being an illegal- transport, aiding, day labor hiring and being one. BUT it does not criminalize the business employing them. Worse, the "penalty" if you could call it that, seems to be a thirty day business license suspension, if that.
Second the bill, no matter how cutely written, causes issues with detention, profiling, Miranda, custody and arrest- the rubber meeting road moment.
http://truthandcommonsense.com/2010/04/28/arizona-law-has-no-teeth-for-the-businesses-a-bunch-of-outs-fueled-by-political-connections-it-was-too-good-to-be-true/
http://truthandcommonsense.com/2010/04/25/telling-the-story-of-blue-haired-club-footed-midgets-and-stopping-a-known-drug-dealers/
Posted May 2, 2010 at 9:45:40 AM
Matthew Swaringen
Immigration laws are of the same level of perversity as any other arbitrary government restrictions. Proponents of liberty have no rational argument to support the idea of immigration restriction. It's ridiculous to talk about due process of law when you are talking about the basic freedom of movement. What better way can people be taught the benefits of liberty than being granted the ability to come into this country and leave freely?
The only reasonable argument for immigration restriction is that immigrants could theoretically be taxing our already ridiculous welfare state, but then why not attack the true problem, the welfare state itself? Arguments about them "stealing" our jobs presumes we own "our" jobs and is the same as arguing against outsourcing, which is hardly a typical conservative position.
The wage rate is an agreement between a willing worker and a willing employer, and if someone else is willing to work for less then you'll have to prove you are more productive/etc. to get a higher wage. If the problem is that they are cheating our "minimum wage" system, I agree, lets get rid of that while we are at it. That system has been causing unemployment & lack of opportunities for on the job training among youth for a long time.
Now, I'll agree some who have attacked the Arizona law have not been entirely fair about it's specific exclusions against profiling, etc. However, lets not forget that the police are not perfect. They are human beings and it is natural for them to act in a way that is consistent with what they see. Even if the law says "no profiling" at the end of the day profiling will mean more people of one race are asked than another. This is logical. If you have a law that affects a cross-section of the population that is predominately one race either profiling will occur, or in a huge reversal due to political correctness, profiling will be avoided by quotas (police will be told they have to question as many whites as others). There is just not a positive direction enforcement of this law can go, and it's fundamentally opposed to the principles of this country, of allowing free people the right to move freely.
Posted May 2, 2010 at 12:38:14 PM
Jonathan
I'd bet most of the people that say they are against it because of racial profiling are really against it because they want open borders and amnesty for all the illegals already here.
They don't want the federal law enforced by the feds either or the border secured. They want all the illegals here they can get because a good portion of them will be lower income pay no taxes and be on welfare thus being democrat voters whenever they give them amnesty.
Posted May 2, 2010 at 2:34:54 PM
Hard Thought
Arizona absolutely did the right thing.
I have no problem with people coming here legally.
I was married to a Korean and before she was naturalized she was required by law to have proof of her citizenship status on her at all times.
That is the law and it should be enforced.
Illegal immigrants were expelled under Eisenhower and should be, again. His administration removed over 12 million illegals in less than 24 months. That is an example to emulate.
Posted May 2, 2010 at 2:44:12 PM
Bob W
Does a bear s**t in the woods?
Every other state should follow suit; that will reform the system and Washington.
Ship 12 million illegal aliens back to the coutry's they come from and; that's 12 million jobs for American citizens, that's $12 dollars less each person pays in taxes; that's 12 hours less in emergency room waits, and likely, that's 12 less crimes committed per hour around the country by illegals.
Good statistics, and love the numbers too. Let's do it!
Won't happen: the liberals will have none of it, because, that's 12 million voters they will lose to get them reelected.
Posted May 2, 2010 at 3:34:18 PM
Rob P
What has become of us as Americans and what it has taken us to get this far. Everyday we become more and more relaxed on who runs our country, finally there is a governor who steps up and says this is what we are going to do for our citizens it is right and the federal government wont do it so we must stand up and say enough is enough. What has our media done but to say what a big mistake they have made and refriding on personal rights and racist this law is. Well I for one hope they stand strong and all other states fall in line with a similar bill. I will say that I wasnt a big fan of Arizona but now all I can say is way to go and I will vacation there as soon as possible hell I may move there.
Posted May 2, 2010 at 6:39:14 PM
OregonBuzz
Arizona definitely did the right thing. One of the powers granted to the U.S. government is to protect the national borders. They abrogated the throne so to speak via purposeful neglect, and I include John McCain in that traitorous group.
Of course, one must consider the motivation to get access to all those new voters was probably overwhelming.
The 10th Amendment applies here in my opinion. California, Texas and New Mexico should pass carbon copies of the Arizone bill.
It would also be appropriaate to assist the border states with troops be they National Guard or Regular Army. Our government did mobilize the Guard a year or so ago, but failed to arm them. They were casual observers and nothing more.
Our southern border is a war zone populated with a well defined and identifiable enemy (oops, I'm profiling), which should be apprehended and dealt with post haste.
Just because we have an egomaniacal, dithering socialist with a destructive agenda occupying the white house is no reason to not solve the problem at the state level by whatever legal means.
Posted May 4, 2010 at 12:14:12 PM
OregonBuzz
One more thing. There is no need for "reform". There is however a dire need for application of existing law and swift enforcement.
Can you imagine another "Operation Wetback" as orchestrated by Eisenhower? His administration swiftly rounded up some 1 million+ illegals and sent them back in order to clear the way for jobs for returning Korean vets. Well done, Ike.
Posted May 4, 2010 at 12:19:12 PM